Carl talks to Josh Pickel who has had a variety of experiences working in public schools near his hometown of Canton Illinois. Josh began as a science teacher and after some negative experiences left teaching for a time. “I didn’t like how I was being made to work with kids.” He felt “blocked off” from doing things he felt were right.

He has also taught adult GED classes and started a Liberated Learners program, Canton Learning Cooperative, based on the North Star model. https://www.northstarteens.org/ https://kennethdanford.com/

This coming school year (2024-2025) Josh will be working with 7th and 8th grade students in a Social Studies setting. He plans to work with them democratically to build a self directed learning space.

Carl interviews Griffin Toffler about her childhood. She says she was excited to go to kindergarten but that only lasted one day. She later got to attend a summerhill school in New York for a few years which she says saved her life. Now she is a "subversive sub" and is writing a book about how to survive conventional school.

Link to the summerhill movie. https://youtu.be/TxngqMavda0?si=oqfuVCc4UbM6zsKW

Julie Jacobs, MS, RN Education Choice speaks about her work in helping families who are considering education alternatives. She also talks about how school left her in a deficit and what schools need to change to become more effective in promoting learning.

https://www.mnschools.org/