In this episode of SaaS Fuel, host Jeff Mains sits down with Anthony Franco—serial entrepreneur, co-author of AI First Principles and the Wiser Method, and host of the How to Founder podcast—to talk about what it really takes to implement AI effectively in SaaS businesses. The conversation breaks past the usual hype, diving deep into the practical messiness of entrepreneurship, building tech that serves real humans (not just outputs), and how intentional iteration leads to successful outcomes.

Anthony Franco shares brutally honest stories of failure, the necessity of understanding end users, and the importance of starting with a noble cause before diving into AI adoption. If you’re a founder wanting actionable strategies to build a future-proof company in the age of AI, this is your episode.

00:00 "AI, Bias, and Holographic Futures"

03:44 "Future, Revenue Systems, and Strategy"

07:34 "Entrepreneurs Fuel Prosperity"

10:36 "Value Your Job, Avoid Mistakes"

15:02 "Earn the Right to Rebuild"

18:57 "User Experience Insights Revolution"

21:34 Necessary Complexity and Risk Management

25:49 "Leadership's Four Key Relationships"

28:23 "Wiser Method: AI Principles"

32:30 AI Missteps: Autonomy vs Collaboration

35:25 "Challenging Ideas and Biases"

38:03 "Readiness for Agentic Orchestration"

43:00 "Feature Flags & Brand Magic"

“Entrepreneurs are the pioneers of economic prosperity—the ones willing to look foolish bring prosperity to all.” —Anthony Franco

“If you automate broken things, you’re just scaling your problems.” —Anthony Franco

“Design for how the world is—not just how you wish it would be.” —Anthony Franco

“The reason you write software is to make someone’s life easier—not just your own.” —Anthony Franco

“Stop coding. Go talk to the person you’re coding for—not your manager, your end user.” —Anthony Franco

“If you win 10% of the time and fail 90%, you still win. Micro-failures fuel learning.” —Anthony Franco

Lead Arm-in-Arm, Not From Afar

Great leaders work alongside their teams, getting “calluses” from real work

Set Honest Expectations About Entrepreneurship

Don’t sell the dream—share failures and chaos as well as successes to guide founders realistically

Talk to End Users—Don’t Just Delegate Discovery

Leaders must become chief customer advocates; direct feedback is transformative

Don’t Automate for Automation’s Sake

Evaluate the root causes and bottlenecks before layering on tools

Embrace Necessary Complexity

Not all complexity is bad. Sometimes it’s a competitive advantage or required for regulatory compliance

Start Small—Iterate and Learn Before Scaling AI

Focus on incremental improvement, pilot adoption, and learning from failures

anthony@suitepea.com

aifirstprinciples.org

https://www.linkedin.com/in/anthonyfranco/

x.com/anthonyfranco

The Captain's Keys

Small Fish, Big Pond – https://smallfishbigpond.com/ Use the promo code ‘SaaSFuel’

Champion Leadership Group – https://championleadership.com/

Website -

In this mind-bending episode of SaaS Fuel, Jeff Mains chats with Darren Milne, co-founder and CEO of VividQ, about the future of holographic displays and how true 3D experiences will revolutionize everything from automotive HUDs to the way we watch TV, work, and interact with AI.

Darren Milne unpacks his journey from academia to entrepreneurship, describes the defining moment when he saw a real hologram for the first time, and outlines how his team is making science fiction a reality—including progress toward room-scale “holodecks.” Along the way, you’ll learn practical lessons about bridging science and commercialization, building successful licensing models, scaling with partnerships, and staying grounded while pursuing world-changing innovation.

00:00 "Holographic AI Revolution"

05:15 From Academia to Business Shift

14:08 "Holographic Display Business Strategy"

19:31 Automotive HUDs: Future-Ready Adaptability

24:48 "VR Nausea Explained by Science"

29:41 Building-Sized Holograms Revolution

32:57 "Creating Our Own Category"

42:25 "Software-Driven Hardware Control"

47:05 "Challenges of Licensing Innovation"

51:59 "Rethinking Growth and Investment"

56:05 "Epic Holographic Display Project"

01:02:20 "Insights, AI Growth, and Holodecks"

“Sometimes, in the pursuit of knowledge, you need a lot more money—and the way to get that is to create things people want to buy.” — Darren Milne

“The cars are all different, but with holography, the HUD doesn’t have to be. Software solves what used to take an assembly line.” — Darren Milne

“Every time I show a real hologram demo, people still ask if it’s fake. Once you see it, everything changes.” — Darren Milne

“You don’t need to build all the hardware to win big—sometimes licensing your tech brings more scale and staying power.” — Darren Milne

“If money were no object, I’d build the holodeck—an entire room of interactive holograms for training, gaming, everything.” — Darren Milne

“We thought building-sized holograms required new tech, but turns out we could do it with off-the-shelf laptop screens…and a lot of them.” — Darren Milne

Embrace Mindset Shifts

Moving from academia to entrepreneurship means valuing impact as much as knowledge. Sometimes, making ideas real requires leaving comfort zones.

Specialize, Then Delegate

You can’t be both the chief researcher and the chief executive for long. Recognize your strengths and trust your team to handle complementary roles.

Validate with Partners, Not Just Product

Early commercial traction can come from licensing and partnerships, especially when full-scale manufacturing or hardware isn’t feasible.

Solve for ROI, Not Just Coolness

Customers may love new tech, but recurring revenue comes from solving their biggest, most overlooked pain (e.g., HUD manufacturing savings).

Don’t Hire for Vanity, Hire for Necessity

Rapid hiring because “everyone else is scaling” can lead to layoffs and wasted resources if the technology isn’t ready for mass adoption.

Stay Resilient & Honest

Long sales cycles and the need to “build the category” require grit. When mistakes happen (such as premature scaling), own them, learn, and course correct.

https://www.vividq.com/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/darran-milne/

The Captain's Keys

Small Fish, Big Pond – https://smallfishbigpond.com/ Use the promo code...

In this value-packed episode of SaaS Fuel, Mark Osborne, founder of Modern Revenue Strategies and top 25 marketing technology trailblazer, joins host VO and Jeff Mains for a tactical deep dive into building holistic, scalable revenue systems that go beyond the siloed tactics of old.

Mark reveals why random acts of marketing and sales are growth killers, the transformative impact of aligning marketing, sales, and customer success, and practical steps for identifying and nurturing your ideal customers. You’ll also learn how storytelling and “microscripts” can drive trust and reduce friction, the importance of bow-tie funnels (aka the power of retention and expansion), and get a playbook for creating try-before-you-buy offers that accelerate confidence. If you want your SaaS business to be built for significance and scale—this episode is your treasure map.

00:00 "Mastering Sales & Revenue Strategy"

05:11 "Building Effective Revenue Systems"

06:17 Revenue Growth Through Three Systems

12:35 Identifying Top Customers Strategically

13:39 Targeting the Right CRM Customers

19:31 "Aligning Teams to Drive Revenue"

23:49 B2B Buying Shift: Trust Erodes

25:34 Health, Perception, and AI Challenges

29:02 "Bite-Sized Client Value Strategy"

32:12 Effective SaaS Onboarding Strategies

35:49 Focus on One GTM Strategy

40:50 The Power of Specialization

42:35 "Storytelling Powers Human Connection"

47:28 "Creating a Category of One"

48:35 "Collaborative Metrics and Visual Mapping"

52:31 "3D Holograms & AI Innovation"

"But what I find is that really building a revenue system that has multiple components and sort of interlocking components is the real key to growth." — Mark Osborne

Category of One Marketing: "And so we have built a proprietary proven process that leverages our unique expertise for this unique marketplace. And if you believe that that's the right way to solve this problem, then we're the only solution that exists for you." — Mark Osborne

Quote: "the stat is now that something like 70% of the buyer's journey is done before they talk to a single provider, much less you, if you're the second or third tier provider in the marketplace." — Mark Osborne

Lower-Risk Sales Strategies: "it's just a way of giving them that bite of the burger so they can then be excited about coming in and finishing the meal rather than feeling like, well, should I talk to five more people or two more people or get three more references instead." — Mark Osborne

The Power of Storytelling in Sales: "Telling stories is the way that we really resonate and connect with people. So each of those different sort of layers of really small stories and really, you know, sort of large allegories are important throughout the sales process." — Mark Osborne

Build Systems, Not Silos

Sustainable growth comes when every part of the revenue journey is connected—attraction, acceleration, activation.

Customer Obsession Beats Logo Hunting

Long-term companies focus on advocating for and expanding existing customers, not just acquiring new ones.

Say No to the Wrong Revenue

The discipline to turn away poorly-matched clients fuels long-term success and product integrity.

Create Alignment Through Visual...