In this episode of SaaS Fuel, Jeff Mains sits down with Marc Rust, founder of Consequently Creative, to challenge everything you think you know about branding. Marc reveals why the strongest brands aren't built on logos and taglines—they're built on relationships, courtship, and genuine human connection.

You'll discover why "different is always better," how visual storytelling requires education and courtship, and why the interview process should focus on hunger, not resumes. Marc delivers a master class in putting people first, technology last, and building brands that create emotional resonance in an increasingly automated world.

[4:30] - Branding as the operating system for transformation and growth—not a nice-to-have, but the foundation for how companies evolve

[5:55] - The AI capability trap: Technology is being sold based on what it can do, not what humans actually need it to do

[7:17] - Why the Segway failed: Lack of tangible examples and use cases people could identify with (spoiler: only mall cops use them)

[10:40] - The POST method framework: People → Objectives → Strategy → Technology (not technology first)

[11:53] - Courtship in branding: Building relationships requires pacing—don't propose on the first date

[14:07] - The John Hancock disaster: $60-per-click ads driving traffic to pages that didn't sell what customers wanted

[19:30] - Don't make it about you: Focus on your audience's needs, not your own features and capabilities

[25:45] - Hiring for hunger: Job interviews should reveal passion and drive, not rehash the resume

[29:00] - The playground philosophy: Good playgrounds challenge kids and create healthy fear—easy things don't build character

[31:00] - Education as courtship: Walking people through design choices (like using red) builds appreciation and buy-in

[34:15] - Brand color recognition: How cell phone carriers own colors so deeply you know exactly who "the blue one" is

[35:30] - The Marlboro Formula One story: When cigarette ads were banned, they just showed "red and white racing car"—the brand connection was already there

[40:00] - The clarity checklist: What do you do? Who is it for? Why does it matter? What makes you different? What happens next?

Stop leading with what your technology can do and start with what your people need it to do. Follow the POST framework: People (audience

In this episode, Jeff Mains sits down with Tom Rossi, technical co-founder of Higher Pixels and BuzzSprout, to explore what it really takes to build sustainable SaaS businesses. Tom shares the journey from running an internet service provider in the late '90s to creating BuzzSprout, one of the most beloved podcast hosting platforms.

The conversation dives deep into the importance of focus over feature bloat, why support should be treated as a product feature, and how community and brand affinity create lasting competitive advantages. Tom also challenges conventional wisdom about video podcasting, shares hard-won lessons about remote culture, and reveals why "you'll never be as dumb as you are right now" is one of the most empowering principles for decision-making.

[4:26] - The Birth of BuzzSprout: How a simple problem (churches wanting to share sermons online) led to building a podcast hosting platform in 2007-2008

[6:37] - Design as Competitive Advantage: Creating intentional tension between designers and programmers to achieve the best user experience

[7:19] - Support as a Feature: Why your support team isn't an afterthought—it's an unsung feature that drives brand loyalty

[8:13] - The Conference Photo Moment: When podcasters asked for photos with the support team instead of the founders—a testament to exceptional customer service

[11:00] - Spinning Plates to Focused Teams: The evolution from juggling multiple products to going all-in on BuzzSprout when podcasting exploded

[12:11] - The Developer Trap: Why SaaS founders (especially developers) keep building features instead of focusing on sales and marketing

[13:58] - Focus on New Podcasters: The strategic decision to stop competing for existing customers and focus entirely on helping new podcasters get started

[20:06] - Video vs. Audio Podcasting: Why video is being over-hyped and the fundamental difference between the two mediums

[21:51] - The TikTok Disaster Podcast Success Story: How one podcaster used short-form video with disaster images to drive massive podcast growth without ever appearing on camera

[24:28] - Respect the Medium: Create 3-5 minutes of engaging video for discovery, not 45-minute talking head uploads

[28:34] - The 28 Downloads Benchmark: If you get 28+ downloads in the first 7 days, you're in the top 50% of all BuzzSprout podcasts

[34:01] - Building Remote Culture: The challenge of creating autonomy without isolation in fully remote teams

[37:15] - Basecamp & Experiments: How Higher Pixels uses the 37signals approach and lets each team experiment with their own leadership structure

[42:53] - "You'll Never Be as Dumb as You Are Right Now": The empowering principle that delays decisions until you have more information and encourages running minimal experiments

[44:47] - Your First Episode Will Be Your Worst: Why podcasters (and founders) should ship quickly and iterate rather than agonize over perfection

In this episode, Jeff Mains sits down with Barbara Wittmann, a 25-year veteran of IT transformation who has pioneered the concept of "human infrastructure" - the invisible framework of trust, clarity, and collaboration that determines whether technology projects succeed or fail. Barbara shares her journey from mountain biking and logistics to SAP consulting, and how she discovered that most technology failures are actually people problems in disguise.

She introduces her four-pillar model for preventing costly project detours, explains why people development should be a permanent IT budget line item (not a one-time HR initiative), and reveals how AI is raising the bar on what humans need to do best. The conversation explores psychological safety, shared mental models, limiting beliefs, and why wisdom drawn from indigenous cultures can help modern SaaS leaders build more resilient organizations.

[4:56] - Technology problems are almost always people problems - software can't fix misalignment, confusion, or teams that weren't brought along for the change

[8:35] - Human infrastructure is the framework where departments work seamlessly together, end-to-end processes are understood, and people have artifacts to help them navigate complexity

[10:14] - Shared mental models are critical - creating a high-level map of systems, data elements, and functions helps everyone align on what changes will impact

[12:20] - People development should be an OPEX line item in IT budgets, not a one-time HR initiative - we upgrade servers continuously but treat people upgrades as "one and done"

[16:15] - Empowering the middle layer of organizations can save about 20% on consulting spend because in-house people already have the knowledge

[20:20] - The four-pillar model: Understand the problem → Condense it → Create a solution → Get people excited about it (most teams skip understanding the problem)

[22:32] - The dual ecosystem approach: Train people in a cross-industry environment where they can practice without fear, then bring learnings back to their organization

[25:53] - Once 25% of your middle layer adopts a new mindset, you see behavioral shifts ripple throughout the entire organization

[29:00] - Indigenous wisdom teaches that everything is connected (ecosystems) and everything works in cycles - nature isn't "on" all the time

[34:27] - Limiting beliefs often sound like "I can't do that, I've never done that before" - when your instant reaction is "no," pause and get curious about why

[37:17] - AI should be seen as a coworker, not a competitor - the key is training our uniquely human aspects: emotional intelligence, sense-making, and asking better questions

[39:38] - First step to building human infrastructure: Create psychological safety where people can voice concerns, and reconnect with your company's core mission and values

"Most teams learn the hard way: Technology rarely fails because of the tools. It fails because the people aren't aligned to use them." - Barbara Wittmann

"If your company is not really talking to each other as it is, a software is not gonna fix the issue." - Barbara Wittmann

"We are upgrading servers all along, but with people upgrades, we look at it in a very old fashioned way. It's a one and done kind of thing." - Barbara Wittmann

"AI models are evolving at the speed of light, and we are not upgrading our humans. What can go wrong?"- Barbara Wittmann

"Your execution layer cannot delegate complexity anymore because they need to deal with it inevitably."...