My guest today is Ned Abenroth, a creative entrepreneur and wilderness guide who has spent much of his adult life tending to transformational spaces.

For the last 10 years, he’s worked with Illuman, a global spiritual community that was birthed out of Richard Rohr’s work with male spirituality and rites of passage.

In this episode, we explore the distinction between merely growing older and becoming an elder, as well as the cultural gap that has left many adrift without guidance in traversing this threshold. Ned reflect on his personal experiences with grief and illness, having survived an encounter with cancer that reoriented death as a teacher.

And finally, he shares insights from creating the Illuman Elder Rites of Passage program, and the role of myth in orienting elderhood not a solitary journey, but one rooted in community, relationality, and service to future generations.

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LINKS

* Ned’s Official Website

* Illuman Elder Rites of Passage

SHOW NOTES

* Defining Elderhood: Exploration of the distinction between merely aging and truly becoming an elder, with elderhood seen as a relational and community-rooted journey, not simply a function of age.

* Rites of Passage for Elders: Discussion on the Elder Rites of Passage program, emphasizing the process of transition from adulthood to elderhood through rituals, ceremony, and community support.

* Cultural Gaps in Elderhood: Reflection on the modern cultural gap that has left many adrift without guidance in the transition to elderhood, especially in Western societies that often lack healthy rites of passage.

* Elder as a Verb, Not a Noun: Insight into the idea that eldering is not just an identity, but a function—an ongoing role of service, wisdom, and presence that must be actively embodied.

* Grief and Illness as Teachers: Ned shares personal experiences with grief and surviving cancer, which reoriented his relationship to death and positioned it as a profound teacher.

* Death and Diminishment: The role of death work in elderhood, helping elders embrace physical diminishment as a sacred process, and learning to hallow one's aging body.

* Myth and Elderhood: The importance of myth, particularly the story of Elijah, as a guiding narrative for elders, symbolizing the journey into the unknown, surrender, and transformation.

* Impact of Elders on Community: How the presence of true elders strengthens communities, bringing a sense of wisdom, calm, and relational leadership to younger generations.

* Ritual Spaces and Eldering: How the role of elders in ritual spaces creates a sense of safety and presence, often serving as the ballast during moments of collective vulnerability.

* Elders as Truth Tellers: Elders not only offer comfort and grace but are also responsible for being prophetic voices, unafraid to speak hard truths to their communities.

* The Future Vision for Elders: Ned discusses the broader vision of creating rites of passage and eldering programs across diverse communities to reclaim the essential role of elders in modern society.

It wasn’t long after my entry into “mythopoetic masculinity” back in 2015 that I came across the Minnesota Men’s Gathering, a yearly event that began in 1984 by Robert Bly, author of Iron John.

The organization has released a trove of stories & lectures on their Youtube channel from celebrated teachers such as Bly, Lewis Hyde, Martin Prechtel, Martin Shaw, Daniel Deardorff, Malidome Some and many more.

I have been tracking their yearly conference with a desire to attend - and when I heard it was the 40th anniversary, I heeded the call. I reached out and confirmed I my attendance, with the aim to produce a podcast episode afterward to share my experience.

You’re also welcome to join me at the Minnesota Men’s Conference Oct 1-6, 2024. Get full details on their website.

From the official announcement:

The conferences were built around the notion that the souls of men were atrophying in a culture that was essentially in the process of colonizing its own people and of de-animating the living world.

As an antidote to a culture of emptiness, of shallowness, and of disconnection from the web of being, men came together to work with mythic story, with images, with poetry, We placed ourselves into the mythic, into stories that contain traces of the old pathways to becoming a fully developed human being.

The work has continued for 40 years. At this conference, we will look at what has been done, where we have failed, where there have been sweet deepenings, and where the trail may lead.

In my pre-gathering podcast conversation today, I speak with conference organizers & storytellers Walton Stanley and Ben Dennis to discuss this moment of legacy and renewal.

Both guests share their experiences from the conference, noting its evolution from a focus on Jungian psychology to including broader elements like ritual and influences from indigenous wisdom. They address cultural shifts, the importance of multi-generational participation, and the necessity of a greater narrative for men in today's world.

More about my guests:

Ben Dennis is a mythologist and writer with a love of story, myth, psychology, psychodrama, and storytelling. His mythic interests include Greek mythology, Native American story, European fairy tale, and Hindu epic literature. Ben holds his PhD in Mythological Studies with an Emphasis in Depth Psychology from Pacifica Graduate Institute. Ben retired from the Seattle Fire Department after 28 years as a fire fighter and training coordinator for the Critical Incident Stress Management (CISM) and Peer Support Team. He leads retreats for Veterans and First Responders, and has been adjunct faculty at Antioch University Seattle.

Walton Stanley is a writer and storyteller. He has held a life-long interest in myth, story, and in the power of story to transform the paradigms and frames in which we live. Walton is currently working, with Ben Dennis, on an anthology of selected tales and myths that have been shared in the past 40 years of the Minnesota Men’s Conference He has also completed a book, Following the Wrong God Home, Gilgamesh: The Foundational Myth of Civilization and the Roots of Ecological Collapse exploring th mythic roots of human exceptionalism, and our disconnection from the web of being as expressed in one of humankind’s oldest extant written stories, Gilgamesh.

I’d love to hear your comments. Please share below!

We’re now a month out from our next cohort of The Deep Masculine, a 3 month online journey for men that weaves together mythology, somatics, ritual & brotherhood.

I invited my collaborator Deus Fortier to reflect on our initial journey which we launched earlier this year and completed in June.

At its core, The Deep Masculine seeks to repattern men's relationships with eros - the primal force of life. Drawing from the mythopoetic men's movement and texts like Robert Bly's "Iron John" and "King, Warrior, Magician, Lover" by Douglas Gillette and Robert Moore, we offer a framework to help men rediscover a more intimate sense of aliveness.

In "Iron John," Bly speaks about the Wild Man, the undomesticated male energy that holds the key to a man's soul. This archetype is deeply connected to the wisdom of the earth. Reconnecting with this energy is a recurring theme in our work.

It’s important to make a critical distinction between the "wild" and "savage" man. The former is deeply attuned and rightfully placed within the natural order, while the latter is dangerously disconnected. A savage man is willing to shoot up a shopping mall out of their own self-hatred poured forth as rage against others. This understanding is pivotal in redefining what it means to rewild in a positive, life-affirming way.

Central to our inquiry is the archetype of The Lover. Modern men’s work often prizes the King and the Warrior while neglecting the Lover, whose sensitivity and emotional depth are essential for integrated masculinity.

“The Lover keeps the other masculine energies humane, loving and related to each other.” - Robert Moore & Douglas Gilette

Shadow work is also a significant part of the journey. Often, aspects of ourselves deemed unacceptable are relegated to the shadow. By integrating these parts, men can reclaim lost vitality and unlock deeper wisdom. This process includes exploring sexual shadow, addiction, and infidelity, and forging a pathway for healthier relationships.

In the words of indigenous grandmother Pat McCabe, our ultimate vision is to “realign masculinity with thriving life.” This means developing the Lover's qualities such as courtship and appreciative consciousness, and fostering solidarity among men.

If you are drawn to these themes, we invite you to apply for the next cohort beginning in late September. The application process itself is a valuable reflective journey. We’re inviting a global brotherhood to gather around this fire.

p.s. On Sept 4, I’m also hosting a free webinar An Introduction to Mythopoetic Masculinity. Open to all genders.