Author Stephen Markley opens the doors to The Deluge, his ground-breaking, world-changing Climate/MetaCrisis thriller- 900 pages that absolutely squarely rips into the current system in all its deficiencies - and offers a route through to a future that might work.

This week's guest is someone who has mapped out a possible future in a depth and detail that leaves me awestruck. Stephen Markley's first published novel Ohio, was described as a wild, angry, and devastating masterpiece of a book. Stephen King called it this generation's Grapes of Wrath and there is no doubt that it's a beautifully written, lyrical, devastating debut.

But it turns out Ohio was the book he wrote in the midst of writing the novel we're going to talk about today. The Deluge is nine hundred pages of astonishing depth and breadth that takes as its topic the meta-crisis. It's an excoriating evisceration of neoliberalism and the thousands of small acts of mendacity or cowardice or sheer self-absorption that have got us to the edge of the cliff. It's an examination of just how close we are, and a portrayal of how utterly catastrophic will be the impacts if we step over. It's a deeply political book, but at heart it's also incredibly humane, with a cast of characters that spreads across contemporary American life in ways that I have rarely, if ever, encountered.

I read the book and connected with Stephen because Rupert Read, who was with us last week, called me up and said 'This is a glorious Thrutopian novel, you have to read it.' And there were times when I completely did not believe him. But he's right. it's big. It requires huge dedication. But it's well, well worth the investment in terms of the doors it opens - and the many ways it shows us how we might fail before we finally succeed.

Stephen's website https://www.stephenmarkley.com/
The Deluge https://uk.bookshop.org/p/books/the-deluge-stephen-markley/7544942?ean=9781982123109

We're told so often that people 'don't want the nanny state to intervene' in what we eat or drink or smoke - and often the people saying this are those who employ literal nannies to raise their children. But is it true? What would we learn if someone courageous, with vision, depth and care were to find ways to ask ordinary people what they really feel? #TheFoodConversation is huge - in scope and depth and duration - but more in terms of what it teaches us about how people actually feel, what they actually think, and the massive difference that we can make by helping ordinary people to understand more about how food could be healthy, nutritious and affordable - as opposed to how it is now.

If you've listened to previous episodes of this podcast, you'll know that total systemic change is one of our foundational beliefs: it's coming whether we like it or not and we'd like to manage a just transition rather than waiting to see what arises from the ashes if we keep pushing business as usual until our entire bus dives over the edge of the biophysical cliff.

And so we are always on the lookout for people who not only think systemically, but who get it; who aren't just talking the talk, but who are making things happen on the ground that will lead us all closer to the tipping points of change. Sue Pritchard is one of these people. She's the Chief Executive of the Food, Farming and Countryside Commission, leading the organisation in its mission to bring together people across the UK and the world to act on the climate, nature and health crises, through fairer and more sustainable food systems, and a just transition for rural communities and the countryside.

She is a Trustee of CoFarm Foundation and is an independent Governor at Royal Agricultural University. Sue lives an organic farm in Wales, where she and her family raise livestock and farm for conservation.

This conversation was sparked by the FFCC's inspiring Food Conversation - which brings together ordinary people and begins to unpick the web of deceit surrounding our food - and replaces it with something that is real and decent and nourishing on a physical and systemic level. This was such an inspiring, invigorating conversation and I hope you enjoy it as much as I did.
Food Farming and Countryside Commission
The Food Conversation
Food Conversation YouTube
The case for AgroEcology
CUSP Nature of Prosperity Dialogue
Chris van Tulleken - Ultra Processed People (book)