“We are told that fitting in is the way to be accepted in this world... so the outlier mind is about how do we give people the permission to feel, love and embrace the outlier that’s in them."

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In this episode, I sit with Judy Liu, who is a true rebel in every sense of that word in the corporate world.

Her joie de vivre, her energy and way of seeing the world and the people around her, runs with the refusal to adhere to societal expectations of what should be.

She’s navigated multiple career pivots, defying conventional paths to carve out a niche that defies most people’s expectations of what a career should look like. From learning structural drawings as an aspiring architect, to drafting legal strategies as a student of law degree, to studying psychology as the Head of Learning and Development at Hays.

She also candidly shares about how her diverse background has shaped her own views on leadership behaviours and expectations.

She is a Third Culture Kid, as someone who spent her childhood across seven different schools by the age of 12, and has lived in Australia, Taiwan and now Singapore. It’s perhaps that upbringing and experience during her formative years that has given her such a unique perspective on things, preferring to see things with lightness, humour and cheekiness - rather than giving in to the drudgery of work.

These days, Judy is the founder who runs a new company called The Outlier Mind, which is dedicated to helping leaders uncover their own uniqueness, weirdness even, and building resilience and optimism by thinking differently.

We discuss the power of challenging assumptions, why she leans into difficult moments of conflicts and tension rather than shy away, and why she thinks holding lightness and humour can be the most rebellious thing an outlier can do to be thriving at work.


Key moments:

• What does an “outlier” in corporate look like?
• How she purposely seeks out tension and discomfort, rather than avoiding them
• What is the first thing to do when having difficult conversations
• Why the implicit leadership theory creates more challenges for leaders looking to bring their true selves to work
• The moment her boss called her “shameless”... and how she reacted to that comment
• Being the third culture kid - it can either be really distressing... or really liberating
• Why she believes in keeping a sense of humour and lightness
• Her “fan-girl” moment talking about Derren Brown (with a special shoutout to this English mentalist, illusionist, and writer!)
• .... and the cheekiest thing she ever did!

Connect with Judy:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/judyliucoaching/

Her website:
https://www.judyliucoaching.com/

Connect with Pearl Lim:
linkedin.com/in/pearl-lim-curiousleaderscircle/