For a profession like medicine in which suffering — be it physical, psychological, existential, or spiritual — is so commonly encountered and experienced, we have developed remarkably little shared vocabulary to talk about what suffering means. That is, if we even have the conversations at all.

In early June 2024, during the American Society of Clinical Oncology annual conference in Chicago, we hosted a live podcast event at Northwestern University's Feinberg School of Medicine, gathering Sunita Puri, MD and Jay Wellons, MD, MSPH to explore the great problem of suffering. Dr. Puri, a palliative care physician and author of the best selling book That Good Night: Life and Medicine in the 11th Hour (2019), last joined us on Episode 74: The Beauty of Impermanence. Dr. Wellons, a pediatric neurosurgeon at Vanderbilt University Medical Center and author of the memoir All That Moves Us: A pediatric neurosurgeon, His Young Patients and Their Stories of Grace and Resilience (2022), last joined us on Episode 28: The Brain and All That Moves Us.

The four of us, the guests and co-hosts, start by sharing our personal encounters with suffering, both in our patients and in ourselves, before discussing our philosophical approaches to and practical strategies for accompanying patients through suffering, managing spiritual distress, contextualizing our own humanity in these encounters, maintaining our own well-being, and searching for meaning amid these tragic moments, if it is possible. After our main discussion, we also answer audience questions about managing the sometimes unrealistic and complicated expectations patients have of clinicians, and the role of interfaith discussions among healthcare professionals.

We thank Kelly Michelson, MD, MPH and the Center for Bioethics and Medical Humanities at Northwestern University for making this event possible.

In this episode, you’ll hear about:

3:58 - Stories of confronting suffering, both in professional and personal contexts

29:02 - Practical tips for coping with suffering and uncertainty as a physician

31:53 - The importance of psychological safety in feeling and expressing your emotions as a physician

36:52 - Being present in the moment while accompanying patients through difficult times

40:00 - Helping doctors re-connect with the deeper reason of why they feel called to medicine

42:24 - The inexplicable relationship between love and loss

52:04 - The deep sense of meaning inherent in the work of a physician and what makes it “real”

54:41 - Q&A: How physicians can better navigate the challenging expectations patients have as well as medical skepticism

1:04:05 - Q&A: How we can better incorporate interfaith dialogue into medical training and practice

Dr. Jay Wellons is the author of All That Moves Us (2022) and can be found on Twitter/X at @JayWellons5.

Dr. Sunita Puri is the author of That Good Night (2019) and can be found on Twitter/X at @SunitaPuriMD.