Beth Ann Kaminkow is CEO of Dentsu North America. She brings a rare candour about why so many agency groups struggle to articulate their strengths, and why Dentsu is choosing to double down on strong, clearly positioned brands rather than chasing endless consolidation.

She shares her perspective on where independents are winning, why speed and specialisation matter more than ever, and how global networks leverage their scale advantage.

Thoughtful, optimistic and grounded in real leadership experience, Beth Ann also cuts through the hype on AI, from its impact on creativity and craft, to increasing appetite from clients for new pricing models.

HIGHLIGHTS:

[03:06] How technology amplifies longevity

[03:56] Restoring growth

[08:18] The ‘One Dentsu’ model

[12:24] Client-led media strategy

[19:08] AI as media channel

[22:22] Pricing unique IP

[24:06] The needs that indies meet

[28:24] Staying focused amidst gossip

[31:55] How cynicism hurts the industry

[35:44] The next wave of creativity

MORE ABOUT BETH:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/beth-ann-kaminkow

Mentioned in the episode:

Robin’s book – Market of One: amazon.com/Market-One-rewrite-competitive-advantage

HOST SOCIALS:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn

Twitter: twitter.com/robonn

MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:

Website: codefinery.com

Book: Market of One

Mentioned in this episode:

Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire

Is your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Diagnostic Questionnaire Landing Page

Today’s guest is Zoe Scaman, founder of Bodacious – and one of our industry's most original and outspoken thinkers. She’s built her career by following her curiosity, from her early days at Naked Communications to optimising her own business around freedom and variety.

Zoe shares her take on why the traditional agency model has reached breaking point, how creativity is being squeezed by efficiency, and what a new era of talent could look like. She also speaks about building her personal brand, using writing as a thinking tool, and the importance of openness, vulnerability and speaking out.

If you’re questioning what’s next for agencies – or yourself – Zoe offers both a reality check and a dose of inspiration.

HIGHLIGHTS:

[02:03] Freedom to be 'Bodacious'

[04:24] The magic of misfits

[08:35] Death by a thousand cuts

[13:11] Data versus creativity

[15:07] Freedom versus growth

[21:44] The grey soup crisis

[25:30] Breaking silence with courage

[27:56] Thinking out loud in public

[33:59] Learning through disagreement

[37:54] Branding by machines

MORE ABOUT ZOE:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/zoescaman

Website: bodacious.be

HOST SOCIALS:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn

Twitter: twitter.com/robonn

MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:

Website: codefinery.com

Book: Market of One

Mentioned in this episode:

Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire

Is your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Diagnostic Questionnaire Landing Page

Today’s guests are PJ Pereira and Andrew O’Dell, co-founders of renowned creative agency Pereira O’Dell as well as their AI venture SILVERSIDE– fresh from delivering Coca-Cola’s fully AI-generated 2026 Holidays Are Coming campaign.

Alongside the controversy and lessons learned, PJ and Andrew explain why SILVERSIDE was spun-out as a separate business, how speed and experimentation are reshaping creative processes, and why culture is everything when navigating change.

They also explore how AI is accelerating pressure on traditional agency business models – from production workflows to how value is priced and rewarded. This is an honest, optimistic conversation about fear, reinvention and leadership in a moment of rapid transformation.

HIGHLIGHTS:

[02:13] Reinventing an icon

[07:57] From creative indie to AI Lab

[15:48] Resilience in the echo chamber

[17:18] Finding the hand raisers

[23:45] Rethinking creative value

[26:00] Exposing broken models

[30:31] Learning by doing

[33:14] People-first mentality

[36:01] The gap between indies and network agencies

MORE ABOUT PJ PEREIRA AND ANDREW O'DELL:

LinkedIn (PJ): linkedin.com/in/pjpereira

LinkedIn (Andrew): linkedin.com/in/andrew-o-dell

SILVERSIDE AI: Silverside.ai

HOST SOCIALS:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn

Twitter: twitter.com/robonn

MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:

Website: codefinery.com

Book: Market of One

Today’s guests are Brian Wieser and Olivia Morley – not only the co-hosts of the fantastic ‘Agency Business’ podcast, but Brian is also a seasoned analyst across advertising, tech and finance, and Olivia is an editorial and communications specialist, formerly of Adweek and Forrester.

Together, they bring an unusually rigorous focus to the choices agency leaders make. We explore why the sector is not, despite the prevailing narrative, in crisis – and why metrics such as capital efficiency and long-term value creation are often overlooked.

Olivia offers a critical perspective on organisational structure, culture, and operational reality, while Brian unpacks how agencies should think about investment, scale and survival.

We also dig into whether independents are truly ‘having a moment, the divergence between media and creative businesses, and why holding companies are describing themselves as platforms.

HIGHLIGHTS:

[01:58] Inside agency journalism

[03:58] The business of agencies

[07:12] Curiosity behind decisions

[12:54] Investing wisely

[16:52] Facts over feelings

[21:22] Pseudo independence

[24:38] Media scale versus creativity

[26:53] Agencies as platforms

[31:04] Technology drives consolidation

[37:54] Specialisation as strategy

MORE ABOUT OLIVIA AND BRIAN:

LinkedIn (Olivia): linkedin.com/in/oliviamorley

Fusion Front Media: linkedin.com/company/fusionfront-media

LinkedIn (Brian): linkedin.com/in/brianwieser

Madison & Wall: madisonandwall.com

HOST SOCIALS:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn

Twitter: twitter.com/robonn

MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:

Website: codefinery.com

Book: Market of One

Mentioned in this episode:

Get Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire

Is your agency  really as differentiated as you think? And have you fully embraced the commercial disruption that AI is bringing? To find out, take five minutes to complete Co:definery's diagnostic questionnaire. It's quick, free, and thought provoking, and you get a tailored report with practical guidance for sharpening your competitive edge. Visit codefinery.com/dq

Diagnostic Questionnaire Landing Page

Today’s guest is Luke McKelvey, Co-Founder and CEO of MIRIMAR – the creative company helping brands achieve cultural significance in a world where traditional advertising isn’t enough. And as of last week, ADWEEK’s newly minted small agency of the year for 2025.

Luke reflects on MIRIMAR’s early challenges, from launching ‘too soon’ in 2019 to navigating the pandemic. He also shares how conviction, focus, and a clear filtering system helped them find their footing with the right clients.

The conversation breaks down MIRIMAR’s ‘foundation and fame’ model – aligning brand and business, with smart talent partnerships that create impact without relying solely on paid media.

Packed with sharp thinking, honest lessons, and a healthy dose of optimism, this is a masterclass in building an agency you truly believe in.

HIGHLIGHTS:

[02:02] Navigating early challenges

[06:58] Ambition over status quo

[09:26] The power of clarity

[15:51] Foundation and fame

[17:58] Positioning as an entertainment agency

[26:17] New era of partnerships

[29:18] Aligning intent and incentives

[35:12] Doubling down on insight

[38:47] Why north stars matter

[41:21] Making work worth it

MORE ABOUT LUKE:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/luke-mckelvey

Website: mirimarus.com

HOST SOCIALS:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn

Twitter: twitter.com/robonn

MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:

Website: codefinery.com

Book: Market of One

Today’s guest is Richard Huntington – former Chief Strategy Officer and Chairman of Saatchi & Saatchi. He brings a rare blend of honesty, affection and sharp-edged provocation to this conversation about the agency business.

Richard describes an industry that’s been commodified – caused by the “creative” agency label that stripped out the commerciality, as well as a pitching culture that trains agencies to give away their most valuable thinking for free.

But far from being downbeat, this is a rallying cry for the brilliance inside agencies, and a clear-eyed look at why talent deserves to be paid fairly for the value it creates. From productisation and pricing, to shifting C-suite perceptions, Richard shares his vision for a healthier, more sustainable industry built on confidence, credibility and genuine differentiation.

HIGHLIGHTS:

[02:20] Advertising’s not dead yet

[07:50] Commodified by clients

[09:02] Creative as an adjective

[17:15] Reclaiming agency swagger

[19:41] Collective industry reform

[21:56] Rewriting the rules of pitching

[24:58] The remuneration shift

[28:36] Power of proprietary thinking

[34:12] Golden era of startups

MORE ABOUT RICHARD:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/richard-huntington-59a3761b9

HOST SOCIALS:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn

Twitter: twitter.com/robonn

MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:

Website: codefinery.com

Book: Market of One

Mentioned in this episode:

Market of One

 If you are a fan of this podcast, then you'll love my new book Market of One, how Your Agency can rewrite the Rules and create a lasting competitive advantage. Sharing my experience, repositioning close to 150 agencies over the last decade. Key Highlights: - Insights from repositioning 150+ agencies - Expert contributions from industry leaders Greg Hahn, Rory Sutherland, and Nils Leonard - Strategies for deeper differentiation and increased profitability Learn how to stand out, win more business, and command premium rates. Don't miss this opportunity! Visit marketofone.agency now and unlock your agency's potential.

Diagnostic Questionnaire Landing Page

Today’s guest is Christy Hiler, owner of Cornett – the Lexington-based creative agency – and one of our industry’s leading voices for women-owned agencies.

A huge advocate of empowering talent, Christy candidly shares her own unusual journey from being Cornett’s president to its owner, including the convictions that guided her forward – and the doubts that held her back.

She talks about the importance of the ‘beautiful but deadly’ venus flytrap in describing what makes Cornett different, as well as her commitment to constant evolution.

Christy also describes how the striking stat that only 1% of US agencies are women-owned sparked the creation of ‘Own It’ – a vibrant community, podcast and summit supporting women who run agencies.

This is an inspiring story and taking charge and making a real difference to the wider industry.

HIGHLIGHTS:

[05:27] The underdog spirit

[09:38] The venus flytrap idea

[13:15] Building long-term relationships

[17:33] Women leading differently

[21:33] The 'Own It' initiative

[28:07] How equity fuels creativity

[32:07] Unlocking potential

[37:13] Doing things differently

MORE ABOUT CHRISTY:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/christyhiler

Website: teamcornett.com

OwnIt

HOST SOCIALS:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn

Twitter: twitter.com/robonn

MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:

Website: codefinery.com

Book: Market of One

Today’s guest is Tyler Turnbull, Global CEO of Interpublic’s FCB – remarkably, the winner of Cannes Lions’ North American Network of the Year for seven years running.

Tyler shares the mindset that’s driven this sustained creative and commercial performance. He unpacks where resilience comes from, and how curiosity, experimentation and a willingness to challenge legacy thinking underpins FCB’s momentum.

Tyler also offers a refreshingly honest view of client relationships – including the crucial roles of empathy and deep commercial impact.

Regardless of whether you’re running a small team or a global network, this is a compelling recipe for ongoing success.

HIGHLIGHTS:

[02:15] The power of consistency

[07:27] Resilience through people

[10:10] Reinvention never stops

[14:31] Walking in your client's shoes

[22:28] Challenging old habits

[30:46] Why small steps matter

[31:40] Culture built on trying

[34:28] Being premium by choice

[42:16] Commercial experimentation

MORE ABOUT TYLER:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/tylerturnbull

Website: fcb.com

HOST SOCIALS:

LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/robinbonn

Twitter: twitter.com/robonn

MORE ABOUT CO:DEFINERY:

Website: codefinery.com

Book: Market of One