On The Way Forward: Regenerative Conversations, John and Alain sit down with Brian McLaren to explore what it means to live—and lead—after doom. Drawing from Life After Doom, Brian reframes “doom” as the moment we realize our problems outsize our current solutions, then walks us from anger to grief to love as a generative path forward. Along the way, we unpack overshoot and the polycrisis beneath climate change, a practical four‑scenario map of possible futures, and everyday practices that keep us grounded—finding companions to talk with, time in nature, and deep honesty in prayerful reflection. The result is a clear‑eyed conversation that neither sugarcoats nor catastrophizes—and calls us to show up with courage, compassion, and love.

Show notes summary

What we cover

• What “doom” really names: not inevitable extinction, but the psychological shock when our problems feel bigger than our solutions—and how naming it opens a path beyond paralysis.
• Under the climate “cherry”: overshoot (taking too much, dumping too much) and the polycrisis that makes single‑issue fixes insufficient.
• Four scenarios for what’s next: collapse avoidance, collapse rebirth, collapse survival, collapse extinction—plus why clinging to certainty (optimism or despair) discourages action.
• From anger → grief → love: how grief can sweeten into love for places and people—and even temper how we regard those doing harm.
• Practices that help right now: find a small circle to talk with; seek daily time outdoors (“the birds are being awesome”); and cultivate honest, contemplative prayer—“holding our thoughts to the light.”
• Faith, power, and coalition: engaging Christian communities without dehumanization; critiquing money‑power capture; and reaching beyond left/right toward a deeper, earth‑honoring vision.

Key takeaways

• Name the feeling; don’t freeze there. Recognizing doom as an inner experience creates room for courage and community.
• Think systemically. If we “solve carbon” but ignore overshoot and the polycrisis, our children still inherit cascading risk.
• Work the middle path. Refusing both naïve optimism and total doom keeps us in the arena of action.
• Grief reveals love. Lament can deepen solidarity with people and places—and clarify what we will protect.
• Lead with love, not dehumanization. Our language matters; contempt escalates violence, while love enlarges coalitions.

Our heartfelt thanks to Elders Action Network (EAN) and Elders Climate Action (ECA) for the work they do and for their support of this conversation and community.

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Web: https://wayforwardpodcast.com Email (comments & ideas): thewayforwardrc@gmail.com

In this episode of The Way Forward Regenerative Conversations, co-hosts Alain Gauthier and Jim Burke, our producer stepping into the host role, dive into humanity’s greatest challenges and the transformative opportunities they present. Join us as they interview Dr. John Izzo, who takes the guest seat to explore “What is the way forward?” for a thriving planet and future. This podcast is a bold call to action, inspiring regenerative practices and mindset shifts to build a better world.

About This Episode

Struggling to stay grounded amidst wars, climate crises, or AI hype? Dr. John Izzo, author of The Five Thieves of Happiness, reveals how five toxic mindsets—Control, Conceit, Consumption, Comfort, and Coveting—are stealing your happiness. Discover the “Notice, Stop, Choose” method to overcome these thieves, practice “attention without attachment,” and challenge outdated patterns like tribalism. From social media coveting to reimagining capitalism, Izzo offers practical tools to transform your inner life and spark outer change. Perfect for activists, elders, and visionaries ready to build a regenerative future.

About Dr. John Izzo

Dr. John Izzo is a bestselling author, speaker, and leadership expert with over 25 years advising Fortune 500 companies like IBM and Coca-Cola on sustainability and regeneration. His nine books, including The Five Thieves of Happiness, blend spirituality, science, and practical wisdom, inspiring millions globally. A former minister and Camino de Santiago pilgrim, Izzo’s TEDx talks and podcasts deliver bold, actionable insights for personal and collective transformation.

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In this gripping episode of The Way Forward: Regenerative Conversations, we dive deep into the explosive revelations of Katherine Stewart’s new book, Money, Lies, and God. With nearly two decades of investigative journalism exposing the rise of Christian nationalism and the anti-democratic forces reshaping America, Stewart reveals the unholy alliances of billionaires, culture warriors, and ideological extremists working to dismantle our democratic foundations. This conversation is essential listening for anyone who cares about truth, pluralism, and the future of the American experiment.

Katherine Stewart is an award-winning journalist and New York Times bestselling author who has covered the rise of the anti-democratic movement in the U.S. for over 16 years. Her latest book, Money, Lies, and God: Inside the Movement to Destroy American Democracy (Bloomsbury, 2025), builds on the critically acclaimed The Power Worshippers and The Good News Club. Stewart’s work appears in The New York Times, The New Republic, and Religion News Service. Follow her work at website https://katherinestewart.me/ katherinestewartbooks.substack.com and on Bluesky at katherinestewart.bsky.social.

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• Elders Action Network – org
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