Michael talks to Chris Heaslip, co-founder of Push Pay, which as far as we’re aware is one of the only faith-based business to make it to Unicorn status ($1 billion+ market cap).

(04:57 - 06:24) Embracing Failure for Innovation
(07:48 - 09:19) Embracing Risk for Growth
(13:05 - 14:00) Explaining Success to Skeptical Audiences
(17:47 - 18:36) Utilizing Technology for Church Outreach
(20:18 - 21:45) Engaging Online Audiences for Outreach
(25:34 - 26:27) Exploring Conversations on B-Side
(29:15 - 30:17) Seeking Relevant Conversations on Christianity
(35:08 - 36:07) AI Efficiency Gains and Transformational Impact

Key Takeaways:
😬 You need to increase your failure rate so that you can discover the blessed path faster (gulp)
📈 The results you can deliver are limited to the risk you are willing to take (ouch)
🧠 Product-market fit is a myth?! How to know when you’re succeeding (spicy)
🖨️ Chris agrees with us that the printing press is the best analogue to our current technological moment (he’s smart, be like Chris)

If the idea of carefully and prayerfully learning good lessons from the business world to apply to ministry gets you very excited, then you are going to want to carve out a half-hour for this episode. Chris is dropping the kind of experience you get by, you know, being led by the Lord to build a company that ends up solving a huge problem for churches worldwide and generates a billion dollars and counting of value.