In Podcast #56 we dive into the big question: how do you use Employee Experience (EX) as a design principle for every CX-transformation? Want to explore and learn more after this podcast? Just send me a DM on LinkedIn!

Zanna explains why the mantra “there’s no CX without EX” only matters when you make it concrete. Expect straight-talking examples, behavioural-science nuggets and loads of practical energy. You’ll learn:

• how customer drivers translate one-to-one into meaningful work for employees;
• why “tiny habits” accelerate culture change without adding time to anyone’s day;
• the three weekly questions every leader should ask to uncover EX barriers;
• plus the ten indispensable tips to embed EX in any CX programme.

The 10 tips in a nutshell

1. Connect all the dots in your transformation story. Show how every CRM, HR or digital initiative serves the customer and the employee.
   
   
2. Link customer drivers to meaningful work. Human drivers such as personal attention create five-times more impact and resonate instantly with staff.
   
   
3. Create journey & channel teams. Break silos by letting colleagues co-own one customer journey—instant insight and energy.
   
   
4. Always mirror the employee journey to the customer journey. Map the internal steps behind each customer step and eliminate waste.
   
   
5. Co-create ‘tiny habits’ with employees. Use playful internal campaigns (think angels, warriors, heroes) so teams choose micro-actions that boost key drivers.
   
   
6. Anchor tiny habits in existing routines. Tie every micro-action to something people already do, so it costs zero extra time.
   
   
7. Equip leaders to talk CX daily. Provide managers with a “question menu” like: “When did you have real customer impact last week?”
   
   
8. Ask relentlessly about barriers. Make “What’s blocking you from delivering great CX?” a standing check-in item.
   
   
9. Measure your human-centric culture twice a year. A survey on the three pillars—customer, employee, purpose—shows whether the pieces click.
   
   
10. Weave CX, EX & purpose into recruitment (and onboarding!). Let candidates solve real customer cases and share authentic purpose stories instead of PowerPoints.

👉 Listen to the full episode for stories, examples and quick wins to drive even more human-centric impact!

Accelerate in Experience Academy

Ready to create more business impact with Customer & Employee Experience? Join the 6-week Accelerate in Experience Academy by Dr. Zanna van der Aa. The proven method for CX transformation that delivers measurable results in just 3 months.

🌍 Trusted in 20+ countries by 11+ global brands such as Randstad, Allianz, Zain and Egon Zehnder. Now available online.

👉 Start your journey: https://academy.zannavanderaa.com/en

More info?
Newsletter -> https://zannavanderaa.com/cxleague/
LinkedIn -> https://www.linkedin.com/in/zannavdun/
YouTube -> https://www.youtube.com/@dr.zannavanderaa
Website -> https://zannavanderaa.com/
Dutch version podcast -> https://beleving.buzzsprout.com

Turning CX from a project into daily practice takes more than slogans. This episode shares a practical COO playbook and if you’d like to explore bringing this to life, just drop me a DM on LinkedIn.

In this episode of the C-suite series dr. Zanna van der Aa and Miranda Nijenhuis discuss the top five COO benefits and behaviors for successful CX transformation, aimed at executives who wonder: “How can I make sure that CX transformation in our organization is successful?”

Here are the 5 most valuable insights summarized:

Customer-led efficiency unlocks big cost savings. 33–40 % of calls or store visits can be prevented when you use the “first-time-right” metric and journey data; one client cut costs 25 % while raising satisfaction.

Break silos and align KPIs around one story. Journeys force finance, digital, call-center and other teams to see their shared impact, while COOs ensure that every department KPI rolls up to a single goal instead of conflicting targets.

Continuous improvement must be rapid and concrete. Adopt short cycles (Agile, SAFe) and tiny habits so change happens in daily work, not in theoretical models.

Solve the talent shortage through the CX ‘three pillars’. Start with customers, link to employees, then purpose; employees feel their impact and retention rises.

Guard the human side of digital & AI roll-outs. COOs must test fast yet ensure every chatbot or tool still serves employees and customers, not just efficiency metrics.

Together these five habits form a hands-on playbook that enables COOs to cut costs, improve the customer experience, and prove that CX transformation really works in day-to-day operations.

---

Ready to create more business impact with Customer & Employee Experience? Join the 6-week Accelerate in Experience Academy by Dr. Zanna van der Aa. The proven method for CX transformation that delivers measurable results in just 3 months.

🌍 Trusted in 20+ countries by 11+ global brands such as Randstad, Allianz, Zain and Egon Zehnder. Now available online.

👉 Start your journey: https://academy.zannavanderaa.com/en

---

Want to know more about me?

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/zannavdun/
Blog: https://zannavanderaa.com/blog/
Podcast: https://open.spotify.com/show/1A3LisocpUo5F7bXiNqh5n?si=fe6a3a9277dd4ef9
Newsletter: https://zannavanderaa.com/cxleague/

---
00:00:00 Why the COO is critical for CX transformation
00:02:31 The COO’s unique vantage point: from operations to experience
00:04:12 The 5 biggest CX benefits for COOs
00:06:47 From cost control to value creation
00:08:56 Driver analysis: prioritizing with hard data
00:11:22 Journey teams as the bridge between silo

Accelerate in Experience Academy

Ready to create more business impact with Customer & Employee Experience? Join the 6-week Accelerate in Experience Academy by Dr. Zanna van der Aa. The proven method for CX transformation that delivers measurable results in just 3 months.

🌍 Trusted in 20+ countries by 11+ global brands such as Randstad, Allianz, Zain and Egon Zehnder. Now available online.

👉 Start your journey: https://academy.zannavanderaa.com/en

More info?
Newsletter -> https://zannavanderaa.com/cxleague/
LinkedIn -> https://www.linkedin.com/in/zannavdun/
YouTube -> https://www.youtube.com/@dr.zannavanderaa
Website -> https://zannavanderaa.com/
Dutch version podcast -> https://beleving.buzzsprout.com

Embedding CX into culture isn’t easy, but it’s possible. This episode unpacks a real-world playbook from Zain. If you’re keen to explore how to build the same momentum, feel free to connect with me through DM on LinkedIn.

In this episode, Zanna sits down with 25-year-old transformation lead Fahed Alshammari to unpack how Zain turned a one-line challenge—“infuse customer experience into the DNA of every Zainer”—into Unity, a region-wide culture movement. Fahed traces his leap from a dusty construction site to Zain’s innovation hub, where he helped crowd-source 600 frontline ideas in the first year. Purpose lectures and workshops then engaged ≈800 colleagues to co-create the telco’s first formal purpose statement, rooting CX in what employees genuinely care about. The result: CX ownership lives far beyond a department—it shows up in spontaneous elevator pitches and cross-country teamwork.

Together we strip the playbook to its essentials: Customer → Employee → Purpose, led by leaders who make themselves human. Fahed shares how Unity’s C-suite sponsors take an active role—recording frank video podcasts, modelling tiny habits, and backing every story with hard numbers—to turn buy-in into action. His final advice: draft a rock-solid six-month plan, AB-test just 5 % before you scale, and tell the personal stories that ignite change. If you’re wrestling with CX transformation, this conversation reveals how to sprint from ideas to impact—fast.

Accelerate in Experience Academy

Ready to create more business impact with Customer & Employee Experience? Join the 6-week Accelerate in Experience Academy by Dr. Zanna van der Aa. The proven method for CX transformation that delivers measurable results in just 3 months.

🌍 Trusted in 20+ countries by 11+ global brands such as Randstad, Allianz, Zain and Egon Zehnder. Now available online.

👉 Start your journey: https://academy.zannavanderaa.com/en

More info?
Newsletter -> https://zannavanderaa.com/cxleague/
LinkedIn -> https://www.linkedin.com/in/zannavdun/
YouTube -> https://www.youtube.com/@dr.zannavanderaa
Website -> https://zannavanderaa.com/
Dutch version podcast -> https://beleving.buzzsprout.com

Curious how to turn CX from a support function into a true business driver? Rob’s story at PostNL shows what it takes and if you’d like to explore applying these principles, just send me a LinkedIn DM.

In this episode, I’m joined by Rob, one of the driving forces behind the Journey Factory at PostNL. Together, we explore how customer experience (CX) can move from being a support function to becoming a strategic driver of real business impact.

We talk about why many CX teams feel like they’re pulling a dead horse—and what needs to shift for your insights to actually lead to change. Rob shares how PostNL made the bold decision to only start journey projects that the business is committed to finishing. And yes, that means saying “no” more often.

You’ll hear:

- Why starting with the business problem, not the customer journey, changes everything
- How PostNL integrated CX into strategic decision-making with top-down commitment
- What makes a journey team actually effective (hint: it’s not the tooling)
- A brilliant example of customer empowerment through the “Ask the Driver” feature
- Why not starting a CX project can be the most powerful decision you make

This is an honest, practical and energizing conversation for anyone who’s tired of superficial CX and ready to make real impact.

Accelerate in Experience Academy

Ready to create more business impact with Customer & Employee Experience? Join the 6-week Accelerate in Experience Academy by Dr. Zanna van der Aa. The proven method for CX transformation that delivers measurable results in just 3 months.

🌍 Trusted in 20+ countries by 11+ global brands such as Randstad, Allianz, Zain and Egon Zehnder. Now available online.

👉 Start your journey: https://academy.zannavanderaa.com/en

More info?
Newsletter -> https://zannavanderaa.com/cxleague/
LinkedIn -> https://www.linkedin.com/in/zannavdun/
YouTube -> https://www.youtube.com/@dr.zannavanderaa
Website -> https://zannavanderaa.com/
Dutch version podcast -> https://beleving.buzzsprout.com

Tired of defending CX with vanity metrics? This video shows how to anchor it in hard data and if you’d like to discuss applying this approach, just drop me a DM on LinkedIn.

In this podcast, Zanna van der Aa challenges one of the most common requests she hears from leaders: "What’s the business case for CX?" Her response may surprise you.

Instead of trying to justify the value of customer experience with more benchmarks or theoretical slides, Zanna explains why this question often signals a deeper problem — and how to reframe the conversation to focus on measurable impact.

You’ll learn:

• Why asking for a business case can be a red flag
• How to shift from vanity metrics to hard, steerable data
• What happens when you run a driver analysis on just one journey
• How to achieve measurable CX impact within 3 months
• Why CX is not about CX, but about accelerating what matters most

Whether you're a CX professional, leader, or transformation manager, this video will give you a fresh, practical perspective on how to make customer experience work — not as a nice-to-have, but as a business-critical capability.

Accelerate in Experience Academy

Ready to create more business impact with Customer & Employee Experience? Join the 6-week Accelerate in Experience Academy by Dr. Zanna van der Aa. The proven method for CX transformation that delivers measurable results in just 3 months.

🌍 Trusted in 20+ countries by 11+ global brands such as Randstad, Allianz, Zain and Egon Zehnder. Now available online.

👉 Start your journey: https://academy.zannavanderaa.com/en

More info?
Newsletter -> https://zannavanderaa.com/cxleague/
LinkedIn -> https://www.linkedin.com/in/zannavdun/
YouTube -> https://www.youtube.com/@dr.zannavanderaa
Website -> https://zannavanderaa.com/
Dutch version podcast -> https://beleving.buzzsprout.com

Curious how CHROs can become true drivers of CX transformation? This episode lays it out and if you’d like to explore applying these behaviours in your organisation, my LinkedIn DMs are open.

In this episode, we explore the vital role CHROs play in successful CX transformation. We share five key benefits and five concrete behaviors that allow CHROs to drive both employee engagement and customer impact. From onboarding redesign to integrating purpose into leadership development, this conversation offers strategic insights for any HR or CX leader ready to move from theory to measurable transformation.

---

(00:39) Why the CHRO matters in CX transformation

(02:15) Benefit 1, talent acquisition and retention

(05:02) Benefit 2, employee experience as a design principle

(08:34) Benefit 3, culture transformation made tangible

(11:02) Benefit 4, driving measurable business impact

(15:33) Benefit 5, getting a seat at the board level

(17:10) Integrating CX in leadership development

(22:15) Redesigning onboarding with purpose

(32:26) The CHRO as transformation leader

Accelerate in Experience Academy

Ready to create more business impact with Customer & Employee Experience? Join the 6-week Accelerate in Experience Academy by Dr. Zanna van der Aa. The proven method for CX transformation that delivers measurable results in just 3 months.

🌍 Trusted in 20+ countries by 11+ global brands such as Randstad, Allianz, Zain and Egon Zehnder. Now available online.

👉 Start your journey: https://academy.zannavanderaa.com/en

More info?
Newsletter -> https://zannavanderaa.com/cxleague/
LinkedIn -> https://www.linkedin.com/in/zannavdun/
YouTube -> https://www.youtube.com/@dr.zannavanderaa
Website -> https://zannavanderaa.com/
Dutch version podcast -> https://beleving.buzzsprout.com

CX is not the goal — it’s the tool. If you’re ready to link CX to revenue, culture, and purpose, this episode lays out the roadmap. Keen to discuss applying it? Feel free to send me a LinkedIn DM.

Too many organizations treat Customer Experience (CX) as the end goal. But that’s where it often goes wrong. CX is not the goal — it’s a means to an end. A tool to drive concrete business outcomes like cost reduction, revenue growth, a better culture, and real purpose.

In this podcast, we explain why so many CX teams struggle to prove their value and what you can do differently. We share the five business outcomes CX should always connect to and how you, as a CX professional, can make sure your work has real business impact.

You’ll learn:

• Why CX should never be the end goal
• How to link CX to cost reduction and revenue growth
• How CX can drive continuous improvement and experimentation
• Why culture and purpose matter — and how CX accelerates both
• The biggest mistakes CX teams make (and how to avoid them)
• How to start making CX relevant in your organization today

If you’re done with fluffy reports, endless NPS dashboards, and CX teams that don’t move the needle — this podcast is for you.

---

(01:16) Cost reduction & CX
(05:11) Revenue increase & CX
(08:07) CX as a driver for continuous improvement
(11:42) Building a customer-centric culture
(13:54) How CX links to purpose & meaning

(18:37) CX and innovation
(20:25) What goes wrong when CX becomes the goal
(24:14) How to start making CX relevant today

Accelerate in Experience Academy

Ready to create more business impact with Customer & Employee Experience? Join the 6-week Accelerate in Experience Academy by Dr. Zanna van der Aa. The proven method for CX transformation that delivers measurable results in just 3 months.

🌍 Trusted in 20+ countries by 11+ global brands such as Randstad, Allianz, Zain and Egon Zehnder. Now available online.

👉 Start your journey: https://academy.zannavanderaa.com/en

More info?
Newsletter -> https://zannavanderaa.com/cxleague/
LinkedIn -> https://www.linkedin.com/in/zannavdun/
YouTube -> https://www.youtube.com/@dr.zannavanderaa
Website -> https://zannavanderaa.com/
Dutch version podcast -> https://beleving.buzzsprout.com

Mapping journeys but not seeing results? This episode reveals the top 10 pitfalls and if you’d like to explore how to build impactful journey management in your organisation, my LinkedIn DMs are open.

Are you mapping journeys but not seeing real impact? In this episode, I break down the 10 most common mistakes in journey management and how to avoid them.

From lack of data to endless analysis loops, we cover what’s holding CX teams back and how to move from mapping to meaningful improvements.

You’ll learn:

• The 3 journey levels you need to define
• How to prioritize using smart data
• Why execution matters more than theory

If you're serious about creating impact with journey management, this episode is for you.

The 10 Pitfalls:

1. No clarity on 3 levels of journeys
2. No data on Level 2
3. Too fast, too deep
4. Never-ending analysis stage
5. Too much focus on customers
6. No dashboard to start with
7. Too much theoretical frameworks
8. Too many journeys, no execution
9. No common sense
10. Measuring too often or too little

---

(00:00) Introduction and why this podcast matters
(01:33) What journey management really means (vs journey mapping)
(03:25) Pitfall 1: No clarity on the 3 levels of journeys
(09:51) Pitfall 2: No data on level 2 journeys
(11:43) Pitfall 3: Too fast, too deep
(15:26) Pitfall 4: The never-ending analysis loop
(18:16) Pitfall 5: Too much focus on the customer
(21:41) Pitfall 6: No dashboard or an unbalanced one
(22:06) Pitfall 7: Too much focus on theoretical frameworks
(25:58) Pitfall 8–10: No execution, no common sense, and measuring too much or too little

Accelerate in Experience Academy

Ready to create more business impact with Customer & Employee Experience? Join the 6-week Accelerate in Experience Academy by Dr. Zanna van der Aa. The proven method for CX transformation that delivers measurable results in just 3 months.

🌍 Trusted in 20+ countries by 11+ global brands such as Randstad, Allianz, Zain and Egon Zehnder. Now available online.

👉 Start your journey: https://academy.zannavanderaa.com/en

More info?
Newsletter -> https://zannavanderaa.com/cxleague/
LinkedIn -> https://www.linkedin.com/in/zannavdun/
YouTube -> https://www.youtube.com/@dr.zannavanderaa
Website -> https://zannavanderaa.com/
Dutch version podcast -> https://beleving.buzzsprout.com