Despite their revolutionary zeal, followers of Marx have failed to create real economic democracies, frequently ending up with one-party systems that mirror the capitalist structures they sought to overthrow. A compelling alternative exists: a modern vision for economic democracy and employee-owned cooperatives. By examining the historical missteps and unveiling innovative approaches, we discover how true democratic firms can thrive today.

David Ellerman is a distinguished economist, philosopher, and author with a career focused on the crossroads of economics, philosophy, and organizational theory. He has held prominent roles, such as an economic advisor at the World Bank, where he played a key role in shaping development policy and institutional reforms. Before his time at the World Bank, David was a visiting scholar at the University of California, Riverside, and lectured at Boston University.

In this episode, Dart and David discuss:
- The historical context of labor contracts and alienation
- Differences between alienable and inalienable rights
- The link between performance management systems and American slavery
- The flawed basis of Marxist and traditional economic theories
- Real-world examples of democratic firms and worker cooperatives
- The evolution and impact of ESOPs (Employee Stock Ownership Plans)
- The psychological cost of layoffs in an organization
- The role of economic theories in shaping organizational practices
- And other topics…

David Ellerman is a renowned economist, philosopher, and author who has dedicated his career to exploring the intersections of economics, philosophy, and organizational theory. David has held influential positions, including serving as an economic advisor at the World Bank, where he contributed to development policy and institutional reforms. Prior to his tenure at the World Bank, he also served as a visiting scholar at the University of California, Riverside, and as a lecturer at Boston University.

David's books include Helping People Help Themselves and The Democratic Worker-Owned Firm, both of which have been highly regarded in the fields of economics and organizational theory. He has also written extensively for academic journals and popular outlets, contributing to the discourse on economic development, property theory, and worker ownership. David holds his BA in Mathematics from MIT and his PhD in Economics from Boston University.

Resources mentioned:
Helping People Help Themselves by David Ellerman: https://www.amazon.com/Helping-People-Help-Themselves-Alternative-ebook/dp/B071FH7C9Y/
The Democratic Worker-Owned Firm by David Ellerman: https://www.amazon.com/Democratic-Worker-Owned-Firm-Routledge-Revivals/dp/1138892653/
Mondragon Corporation: https://www.mondragon-corporation.com/en/
Anna's Archive: https://annas-archive.gs/?

Connect with David:
Website: https://www.ellerman.org/

Kentaro Toyama spent a decade designing technologies to fight global poverty and improve education and health. As co-founder of Microsoft Research India lab, he made a troubling discovery – innovative technologies can’t create change on their own. Realizing that social progress depends more on people than on the technology they use, Kentaro became a self-proclaimed “geek heretic” who now teaches others the importance of putting people over tech.

Kentaro Toyama is W.K. Kellogg Professor of Community Information at the University of Michigan, a fellow of the Dalai Lama Center at MIT, and author of Geek Heresy. Kentaro is also the co-founder of Microsoft Research India, where he helped grow the lab into 60 full-time research staff.

In this episode, Dart and Kentaro discuss:
- Why technology needs a human touch to succeed
- Kentaro’s leadership at Microsoft Research India
- The 10 fallacies of technology
- Why the most important areas of focus are unmeasurable
- The pitfalls of focusing on the end-goal
- How to create societal change
- Innovation versus tried-and-true approaches
- The law of amplification
- 3 elements of intrinsic growth
- And other topics…

Kentaro Toyama is W.K. Kellogg Professor of Community Information at the University of Michigan School of Information, a fellow of the Dalai Lama Center for Ethics and Transformative Values at MIT, and author of Geek Heresy: Rescuing Social Change from the Cult of Technology. Before moving to Michigan, Kentaro co-founded Microsoft Research India, where he helped grow the lab into 60 full-time research staff.

Kentaro received his PhD in Computer Science from Yale and his bachelors in mathematics from Harvard University. He went on to establish the Technology for Emerging Markets research group, which investigates how the world’s poorest communities interact with technology and ways to support socioeconomic development. Kentaro is also a former researcher for UC Berkeley and former co-editor-in-chief of the Information Technologies and International Development journal.

Resources mentioned:
Geek Heresy, by Kentaro Toyama: https://www.amazon.com/Geek-Heresy-Rescuing-Social-Technology/dp/161039528X

Connect with Kentaro:
www.kentarotoyama.org

Work for Humans wants to understand what people want from work – but every perspective is different. One person’s dream job is another person’s nightmare, making it challenging to define fulfilling work. Derek Sivers captures this struggle in his book, How to Live, which presents 27 drastically different yet equally valid life views. Through his work, Derek guides others in shaping their own meaningful and unique lives.

Derek Sivers is an author, entrepreneur, and speaker known for founding CD Baby, the largest seller of independent music of its time. After selling CD Baby for $22 million in 2008 and donating all the money to charity, Derek began writing and sharing his insights on business, creativity, and living a fulfilling life.

In this episode, Dart and Derek discuss:
- How our beliefs direct our actions
- The 27 ways to live from Derek’s book
- Crafting a company’s personality
- Using beliefs as a listening tool at work
- Derek’s biggest surprise in writing How to Live
- Nature vs. nurture
- Data models as philosophical experiences
- And other topics…

Derek Sivers is an author, entrepreneur, and speaker known for founding CD Baby, once the largest seller of independent music. Derek sold CD Baby for $22M in 2008 and donated all the money to charity, transitioning to writing and sharing insights on business, creativity, and personal development. His books, such as How to Live, offer practical advice and philosophical reflections on living a meaningful life. His latest book, Useful Not True, will be released in 2024.

Resources mentioned:
How to Live, by Derek Sivers: https://www.amazon.com/How-Live-Conflicting-Answers-Question/dp/B09JBMN6Q7
Useful Not True, by Derek Sivers: https://sive.rs/u
“50 Conversations in Bangalore and Chennai,” by Derek Sivers: https://sive.rs/meet-chbg

Connect with Derek:
https://sive.rs/