In this jam-packed episode of SaaS Fuel, sales expert Christian Jack joins host Jeff Mains to break down everything SaaS founders and sales leaders need to know about effective sales demos, discovery processes, psychological safety in sales, team culture, and the evolving landscape of SaaS sales.

Christian shares his journey from music teaching to sales mastery, the critical lessons he learned about sales psychology, and the costly mistakes most SaaS teams make when it comes to demos and team management. You'll also get hard-hitting tactics to boost conversions, examples of SaaS companies that transformed their sales processes, and powerful leadership insights to help you build an unstoppable sales culture.

00:00 Understanding Cost Perception Objections

04:59 "Entrepreneurial Aspirations Amid Uncertainty"

09:33 Trust Over Features in Sales

12:40 Safety Influences Communication Openness

15:26 Tactics for Positive Engagement

20:21 Sales: A Cyclical Journey

23:15 Highlighting Simple Solutions Over Features

25:59 Syntax and Engagement Strategy

29:43 Demo Dilemma: Pros and Cons

31:26 Marketing's Role: Engagement Initiation

35:44 Enhancing Sales with Pre-Call Videos

39:22 Transformational Vocabulary Strategies

42:13 Empowering Message from an Astronaut

47:06 Sales Success Hinges on Culture

48:55 Find Christian Jack Online

"Sales has now become even more of a game of building trust, I think, and building connection with people rather than just, you know, we have the best features, we have the best." — Christian Jack

"We live it through the words that we attribute to the experience. And so if you are talking to somebody about your product, about your service, about your software, et cetera, the words that you use to describe it are very, very important."— Christian Jack

The Secret to Driving Engagement in Software: "How do we actually set up the software in a way where people will actually use it? And what is the specific vehicle that we've used in order to achieve that?" — Christian Jack

"Marketing gets people to the point where they start to lean in as soon as they start leaning in that sales job.” — Christian Jack

"You want to use words like the door is closing or the window is open because that will start to help people envision in their mind, like they can see a door closing." — Christian Jack

Deeper Connections Through Nonverbal Communication: "And you can focus on other parts of the interaction, how they're reacting, what the response is, facial expressions, those kinds of things." — Jeff Mains

"The dividing line between those two, marketing, sales and then where are they separate and then how do they work together best?" — Jeff Mains

Biggest Competitor in SaaS Sales: "the biggest competitor that I think we all have in the marketplace is no action, no decision." — Jeff Mains

Culture Over Numbers

Your sales team’s culture is the foundation of consistent performance and retention—it’s critical for growth and survival.

Sales and Marketing Must Work in Harmony

Marketing makes people “lean in”; sales takes over when a prospect is engaged. Align these efforts for maximum ROI.

Prioritize Discovery, Not Just Demos

You can’t sell a prospect unless you deeply understand their context. Tailor every demo and sales conversation.

Empower with Psych-Safety

Prospects buy when they feel safe. Your job isn’t just handling objections, but creating an environment of trust and...

What happens when you challenge the status quo of Agile, throw out bloated teams, and supercharge small pods with AI?

In this episode, Jeff Mains sits down with Mac, founder of Wednesday Solutions, to explore the evolution of product development teams. Mac shares why he believes traditional Agile is obsolete and how his company’s “product pods” are delivering massive impact with lean teams.

Dive into real-world strategies on using AI to automate grunt work, focus on real customer value, and deliver faster than ever. Mac and Jeff also discuss over-engineering pitfalls, the essential Sprint Zero, and what’s next for tech leadership in the age of AI.

00:00 "Impactful Small Teams"

06:03 AI-Powered Engineering and Vibe Sprints

07:15 "AI-First vs. Human-First Mindset"

10:33 Rural Loan Tech Success

15:28 "Sprint Zero: Focusing on One Problem"

16:50 User-Centric Product Roadmap Creation

20:00 AI: The New Industrial Revolution

25:09 From Doing to Empowering Others

27:18 Embrace Incremental Change

30:47 Thoughtful Hiring in App Development

35:53 "Utilize Managed Services First"

37:15 "CTO: Bridge Across Tech, Product, Business"

AI-First Mindset: "Are you AI first or are you human first? Do you typically think of how I can do this myself, or do you think about what tools I can use to leverage, what tools I can leverage to actually get this done?" — Mac

Viral Topic: The Dangers of Over-Engineering Early

"don't try to build for scale before you even get your first user. Sort of like not over engineering over there is very important." — Mac

The Power of Interdisciplinary Collaboration: "So when I think about it, having a product manager with tech experience or engineering experience and sort of bringing the intersection of these two disciplines together is first and foremost, most important." — Mac

The Art of Delegation: "The question that I keep asking myself at the end of every week is how well would things have gone if I wasn't there for this week? And how well will things go if I'm not there next week, right?" — Mac

Viral Topic: AI and Interview Strategies: "What was possible to build in weeks or months earlier is now possible within a few minutes with a few prompts."— Mac

The Dangers of Confirmation Bias in Product Development: "And so we build a product and then get to the end. And it's not really what the market was looking for or it was close, but it's off a little bit." — Jeff Mains

Viral Leadership Secret: "The most successful leaders aren't lone heroes. They're the center of four specific relationships that multiply their impact while preserving their sanity." — Jeff Mains

True Velocity Comes from Focus, Not Headcount:

Small teams with well-defined roles and clear ownership far outpace large, fragmented ones.

Delegate Relentlessly:

Great leaders empower others to own outcomes, not just tasks—Mac constantly asks how his absence would impact the team.

Start with the Problem, Not the Solution:

Sprint Zero ensures the product addresses a real, validated user pain—don’t let assumption drive your build.

Embrace Incremental Change:

Don’t fall for the “big-bang” launch myth when modernizing systems; ship value early and often.

Hire for Specialization, Not Generalization:

Early mistakes in hiring generalists slowed quality—now, experts who excel at their craft yield superior results.

Leverage AI as a Force-Multiplier:

The best...

Are you hiring your first go-to-market team, or looking to scale your B2B SaaS sales organization? In this episode of SaaS Fuel, Jeff Mains sits down with William Spengler, founder of Frederick Fox, to discuss the realities—and pitfalls—of building a high-performing sales team for SaaS startups.

Will reveals why most early sales hires fail, how the staffing industry is undergoing disruption, and his blueprint for assembling a scrappy, effective team in a marketplace crowded with resumes and inflated claims. The conversation ranges from the challenges of hiring senior versus raw talent, the tactical necessity of reference checks, the evolving role of AI in recruiting, how to avoid cash crunches even when revenues are up, and why clarity in your hiring process is the foundation of success. If you’re ready for a brutally honest, actionable guide to hiring and scaling (without the fluff), this episode is for you.

00:00 Effective Sales Strategy & Hiring

04:56 Real Estate-Style Recruiter Model

08:51 "Reality Check: Starting a Firm"

11:47 Competitor Research for Business Growth

15:04 Defining Critical Hiring Needs

20:49 Experience Over Elbow Grease

22:14 Streamlining Interview Processes

28:25 Incentivizing Sales with High Commissions

29:57 "Finding High-Performing Sales Talent"

36:37 AI Tools in Recruiting: Limitations

40:02 The Limits of AI Interviews

42:33 Building an Effective GovTech Sales Team

45:24 Verifying Sales Candidate References

50:14 "AI Systems & Sales Strategies"

Quote: "I would say start to target their top salespeople. That's really what recruiters do. We do the research, we cold call, we email them and we sell your value proposition." — William Spengler

How to Attract Top Talent: “A player is going to pick up on that confidence and is going to want to join you. If you're going to go, if you're going to talk to Lebron James and you're not confident, they're not going to take you seriously." — William Spengler

Viral Topic: The Traits of Top Sales Talent: "I always think that's a red flag when a really good salesperson is paycheck to paycheck, that it's sort of a red flag." — William Spengler

"It's not just about hiring someone with a shiny resume or a smooth pitch because they all seem to have that." — Jeff Mains

The Secret to Unstoppable Leadership: "It's not strategy, not charisma. It's not even luck. It's relationships. — Jeff Mains

Build for Clarity, Not Convenience:

Ensure all stakeholders align on what the business truly needs from a hire before you start searching for "unicorns."

Check the Hype at the Door:

Don’t just trust claims and shiny resumes. Take the time to verify past performance, especially for sales roles.

Know Your Numbers—And Theirs:

Ask candidates detailed questions about past targets and results, and verify them. Top performers are always eager to share real numbers.

Prioritize Process Discipline:

A clear, concise hiring process beats endless rounds every time. Do more work upfront—it pays off with better hires.

Scale Operations Before Sales Explode:

Investing in back office, accounting, and compliance early prevents massive headaches and cash crunches when you scale rapidly.

Bet on Talent That Bets on Themselves:

Seek out salespeople willing to trade high base salaries for high upside. These are often the true A-players.

This week on SaaS Fuel, Jeff Mains dives into radical innovation at the intersection of technology, storytelling, and human impact. Guest Sean Schroeder, exited founder and product strategist, unpacks his journey from digital content platforms to autism therapy and AI-powered brand storytelling.

The episode covers Happy Ladders’ parent-led autism therapy model, the philosophy behind Reventure Labs' unorthodox venture studio, and the technical artistry fueling Story Cycle Genie—a collective intelligence platform powering authentic brand narratives. If you’ve ever wondered how SaaS can drive real transformation or how founders can operationalize their own unique “vibe” into assets that scale, this episode delivers actionable insight with heart.

00:00 "Parent-Led Autism Therapy Revolution"

04:51 From Content to Autism App

09:40 Origin of Our Venture Studio

10:31 Audience-Centric Investment Partnerships

13:21 Balancing SaaS and Services Tensions

19:14 "Off Standards, Off Results"

20:24 Streamlined Founder Insight Extraction

23:33 Deep Dive into Audience Archetypes

27:40 Prioritize Planning Over Execution

32:36 Extracting Founder Knowledge

33:46 Pre-Investment Business Idea Testing

38:24 "Governance for Consistent Conditions"

40:08 Seamless Brand Story Coordination

43:58 Data Utilization: Next Steps

47:25 "Integrating Technical Specs and White Papers"

51:18 Recruitment and Innovation Insights

“When you’re working with AI, you’re working at a more atomic level, validating what the genie is giving back—something you’ll rarely get in a room just tossing ideas.” — Sean Schroeder

“The therapist may only be there for hours, but parents are with their children 24/7. Empowering them turns everyday moments into therapy.” — Sean Schroeder

“Founders move quick. Our job is to extract their embedded business intelligence—their real story—without months of ‘brand exercises.’” — Sean Schroeder

“StoryCycle Genie lets you build your brand narrative with authentic inputs, not by borrowing someone else’s metaphor but by owning your vibe.” — Sean Schroeder

“If you’re off just 2 degrees at the start, by the time your marketing or messaging hits the world, you’ll be a foot away from where you want to be.” — Jeff Mains

“Sometimes starting without a rigid plan is freeing—some of the best frameworks are discovered through building, intuition, and iteration.” — Sean Schroeder

Empower the Stakeholders Closest to the Problem:

Happy Ladders proves that empowering parents—rather than outside experts—can yield faster and more sustainable developmental progress in children.

Lead with User-Centric Simplicity:

Transform complex frameworks (therapy or branding) into practical, actionable routines that non-experts can implement.

Technical Capital is as Valuable as Financial:

In the modern venture landscape, providing technical expertise and capabilities can catalyze new ventures more effectively than just cash.

Operationalize Authenticity:

Authentic storytelling isn’t found in vague abstraction but in pulling out and refining the founder's real-world beliefs and experiences.

Build Ecosystems, Not Just Assets:

A truly scalable brand is underpinned by systems, connected content, and iterative learning, not just standalone artifacts.

Adopt a Test-and-Learn Mindset:

Start with one asset, test hypotheses quickly (even monetization), and be unafraid to adjust based on feedback and new insights

In this episode of SaaS Fuel, host Jeff Mains sits down with David Ebner, founder of Content Workshop and author of "A Content Marketing Story." Together, they dive deep into the power of storytelling for brands, especially in a world increasingly dominated by AI-generated content. David shares his journey from an MFA in creative writing to agency founder, highlighting how classic storytelling techniques breathe life into business content—even for "boring" brands.

The conversation covers why emotion trumps logic in B2B sales, aligning brand stories with real customer pain points, and how AI is changing (but not replacing) creative content. They also explore building trust, the need for strong brand values, and practical frameworks for developing compelling narratives that make both customers and investors take notice.

00:00 Evolving Content Strategies and Trust

04:50 Founding Content Workshop: Storytelling Essentials

09:00 Evolving Beyond Early Success

11:55 "Post-COVID Digital Shift"

12:57 Emotional Connection in Marketing

16:21 "Helping, Not Selling"

20:53 "AI Refines Quality Content Production"

22:57 Glossary's Impact on Content Traffic

28:51 Hybrid Content Creation Process

31:54 "Prioritizing Quality Over AI Automation"

35:28 "Customer-Centric Corporate Values"

36:14 "Opinionate Only on Relevant Issues"

40:39 "Value Through Personal Engagement"

44:31 "Building Trust for Long-Term Value"

47:10 Faceless Case Studies Boost Relatability

51:22 Story-Driven Business Strategies

Rethinking Corporate Values: "And your values really should be derived from again, the people you're helping. That's really where your value should come from." — David Ebner

"giving away value is the best way that you can kind of build that trust with the audience, influence having your brand influence the relationship with your target audience." — David Ebner

Viral Topic: Why "Sticky" Audiences Matter

"Sticky is just a business term for trust. Having a sticky audience. Sticky client base is valuable, extremely valuable." — David Ebner

The Power of Storytelling in SaaS: "Telling great stories builds more trust than a security badge and closes faster than a limited time offer pop up." — Jeff Mains

The Real Competitive Advantage in the Age of AI: "The difference maker isn't volume. I mean, there's plenty of that slop out there. It's voice."— Jeff Mains

Digital Accessibility is Profitable: "digital accessibility isn't just ethical, it's profitable." — Jeff Mains

Storytelling is Strategy

Weave classic narrative elements into your brand to forge stronger connections and lasting differentiation.

Know Your Audience Deeply

Build and update personas regularly, because markets and customer priorities change.

Emotion Precedes Logic in Every Sale

No matter the industry, purchase motivation starts with emotion—lead with empathy.

Stay Human in the Age of AI

Use AI to enhance productivity, but protect and amplify your unique voice.

Brand Trust Is a Long Game

Invest in evergreen content and consistent value, even if ROI isn’t immediate—it pays dividends in loyalty.

Tested Values Define Your Brand

Values are...

In this episode of SaaS Fuel, host Jeff Mains welcomes Jonathan Mast, a pioneering AI educator, digital strategist, and founder of one of the fastest-growing AI-focused online communities.

Together, they unpack how artificial intelligence is revolutionizing productivity, streamlining operations, and empowering both leaders and teams across SaaS and B2B businesses. The conversation focuses on AI as an amplification tool—making experienced people even more valuable—and delivers practical, no-hype insights for founders seeking scalable efficiency.

Jonathan delves into the real-world ways AI can give companies a competitive edge, from customer support and sales enablement to operations and hiring.

[00:00:00] AI as The Ultimate Assistant:

Good salespeople are now augmented by AI tools, making information and CRM capabilities accessible anywhere—speeding response, shortening sales cycles, and enabling closing deals faster.

[00:11:17] AI Amplifies Experience:

AI doesn’t replace people; it increases their productivity and ability to deliver value, allowing businesses to do more with the same (or fewer) staff while opening new growth opportunities.

[00:17:08] Tool-Agnostic Approach:

Success with AI isn’t about picking the perfect tool—ChatGPT, Gemini, Copilot, or others all provide value. It’s about using what you have to get reliable results right now.

[00:18:52] Quick Wins > Transformation:

Start by identifying monotonous, “red light” tasks for AI to tackle. Small time savings (e.g., drafting SOPs, professional emails) quickly add up, freeing leaders to work ON the business.

[00:35:15] Personalization in Sales and Marketing:

AI empowers personalized targeting and messaging at scale, making sales reps more effective and enabling much faster sales cycles.

[00:38:01] Sentiment Analysis for Better Support:

AI-driven sentiment analysis delivers consistent, objective insights into customer emotions—improving CSAT, retention, and allowing automation of key support processes.

"AI doesn't replace experience—it amplifies it. The more seasoned your team, the more powerful the results." — Jonathan Mast

"Stop looking for the perfect AI tool. Use what you have—what matters is the value it delivers today." — Jonathan Mastt

"Start by giving AI your most dreaded, repetitive tasks. Those 5-10 minute wins stack up faster than you think." — Jonathan Mast

"AI empowers us to deliver more value, make more money, and save time—all at once." — Jonathan Mast

"Personalization at scale is now possible. AI lets sales and marketing speak to one, not thousands." — Jonathan Mast

"To scale efficiently, don't try to plan every step. Let quick wins with AI reveal new opportunities and excitement." — Jonathan Mast

Adopt AI as a Collaborative Partner:

View AI as an “amplifier” that helps you and your team excel, rather than as a replacement.

Start Simple—Avoid Overwhelm:

Focus AI integration on repetitive, low-value “red tasks” before tackling complex automation.

Prioritize Speed of Implementation:

Rapid execution using AI enables compounding results—don’t wait for perfection to start.

Empower Teams Over Replace Them:

AI frees people from busywork, unlocking time for strategic, high-impact initiatives.

Stay Practical, Not Hype-Driven:

Ignore the constant flood of AI news and focus on proven tools and tactics for your business...

This episode dives deep into digital accessibility—why it’s more than just ticking a compliance box and how it can unlock business growth, improve user experience, and amplify engagement across your B2B SaaS company.

Jeff Mains chats with Mike Barton, VP at AudioEye, about transforming digital content and experiences to be truly inclusive. Together, they explore practical strategies for simplifying messaging, overcoming the “curse of knowledge,” leveraging AI as a creative partner, and using storytelling to create content that resonates with and includes everyone.

If you’re looking to scale your SaaS, boost SEO, or just build a business of significance, this conversation is full of actionable wisdom.

00:00 Inclusive Content Creation Strategies

05:59 Emphasizing Digital Accessibility Awareness

09:36 Unlocking a $13 Trillion Market

10:28 Accessibility: A Revenue Opportunity

15:51 Digital Accessibility for All

19:50 Simplifying Content for Quick Impact

22:29 "Storytelling Enhances Data Impact"

24:30 User Experience Roadblocks Analogy

30:27 Pre-Demo Decision Influencers

33:49 Collaborative Storycrafting in Business

36:40 Creating Unified Brand Narratives

38:29 Engaging Brand Storytelling Techniques

43:56 AI Enhances Content Creation Efficiency

45:39 AI Clarifies Better Than Humans?

48:58 Free Accessibility Site Scan

51:18 Streamlining Growth: AI to Storytelling

Digital Accessibility Matters: "This isn't about just checking a compliance box. It's unlocking your full audience potential and improving the experience for everyone, not just those with disabilities." — Mike Barton

"But here's the kicker. Simplifying content, ditching jargon, and designing with clarity not only helps users with visual, cognitive or mobility challenges, it boosts your SEO, increases engagement, and actually converts better." — Mike Barton

Viral Topic: The Power of Emotion in B2B Storytelling: "data informs and emotion transforms." — Mike Barton

Why Simplicity in Web Design Matters for Everyone: "Simplicity sells, simplicity scales." — Jeff Mains

Quote: "Well, the first place it goes wrong is that there is no overarching brand story or narrative. You just have a bunch of content islands that exist across all your channels that are telling different stories." — Jeff Mains

Quote: "Most people are shocked to find how many issues exist on their site and how difficult it is for a person with a disability." — Jeff Mains

Empathy-led Leadership:

Lead your content, teams, and company by keeping customer experience at the forefront, especially for those often excluded.

Challenge Default Thinking:

Don’t treat accessibility as a compliance task—see it as strategic growth and innovation opportunity.

Simplify Relentlessly:

Precision beats paragraphs. Prioritize clarity in your messaging for every audience segment.

Make Others the Hero:

Elevate your users’ journey and outcomes, not your brand’s accolades.

Leverage Team and Community Feedback:

Build a creative "brain trust" for testing and refining ideas—it’s never a solo act.

Embrace Technology with Humility:

Use AI not to replace the human touch but to supercharge your team’s abilities and your content’s impact.

mike.barton@audioeye.com

www.audioeye.com

https://www.linkedin.com/in/omnibarton/

How can job seekers win in a world where roles attract hundreds—if not thousands—of applicants and the hiring process feels like a black hole? This week, Jeff Mains is joined by Garrett Rice, co-founder and CEO of Callings AI, for a compelling look at how AI and modern SaaS tools are reshaping the job hunt—for the candidates themselves.

Garrett draws on his extensive tech background—including years at Apple—to outline why today’s employment search is fundamentally broken, and how Callings AI equips job seekers with workflow, networking, and optimization tools to regain control, clarity, and confidence on their path to a new role. The conversation is rich with actionable insights on standing out, networking with intention, and designing products for real user needs. If you’re a SaaS founder, product builder, or simply navigating your own job transition, this episode is a masterclass in both leadership and innovation.

00:00 Empowering Job Seekers with SaaS

04:28 "Career Shift: From Apple to AI"

08:31 Job Application and ATS Challenges

10:51 "Optimizing Job Application Success"

14:48 AI-Enhanced Job Networking Tool

18:29 "Comprehensive Job Search Support"

21:55 Networking Unlocks Hidden Job Market

24:50 Streamlined Job Matching Platform

27:32 AI Boosts Efficiency and Fun

30:20 Improving Candidate Discovery

35:34 "Embrace Internal Growth Over Consultants"

40:05 Division of Roles in Partnership

41:18 Resume Enhancement Tool Unveiled

45:31 Earning Customer Trust Over Awareness

49:25 "Sales Hiring and Resource Sharing"

"The number one way to win a job is to get out of the pile and into the ‘You’re being considered’ pile—and that’s done through networking." — Garrett Rice

"AI won’t magically solve the job search, but it can finally help level the playing field." — Garrett Rice

"Your resume is a piece of paper. When you reach out, you become human to the company." — Garrett Rice

"If you’re not iterating, you’re not building. Success is just well-managed failure and learning." — Garrett Rice

"Credibility is earned, one relationship at a time—it’s not just about getting your name out there." — Garrett Rice

The Power of Referrals: "I think that the referral incentive is huge and most people completely underestimate that or forget it exists." - Jeff Mains

Iterate Relentlessly:

"You build, it works a little bit, it doesn’t work in parts. You rebuild and you iterate and iterate and iterate.” — Learn as you go. Product-market fit is a process, not a one-time discovery.

Mission-Driven Building:

Stay laser-focused on delivering value to your core user—even when others try to pull you toward more profitable, “easier” directions.

Make Networking Frictionless:

In both leadership and job search, proactively and intentionally connecting with others is non-negotiable for success.

Credibility Over Noise:

The brand battle isn’t just about visibility. It’s earning trust, one genuine connection at a time, that matters now more than ever.

Co-Founder Synergy Matters:

Build with people you respect and align with. Complementary skill sets and shared values are a startup’s real superpower.

Embrace the Unknowns:

“The idea that you have when you start… is never how it works out.” Be ready to hack through the jungle, not stroll down a paved path.

garrett@callings.ai

callings.ai

https://www.linkedin.com/in/garrettrice